2026-09-16 - Finance Committee Meeting

Summary

The Charlton Finance Committee (summary built from ASR auto-captions; speakers are unlabeled and names are approximate) opened by approving the February 25, April 28 and May 18 minutes, each by a 4-0 vote with one abstention. The town's finance staff ("Ashley") then walked the committee through how free cash is calculated and certified: roughly $6M in undesignated fund balance, less outstanding property-tax receivables, about $281K of deficit grants (mostly reimbursement timing, e.g. Green Communities and police detail billing) and the overlay/deferred-revenue offsets, yielding certified free cash of about $2.8M (within 1% of last year; the record was a little over $3M two years ago). Water came in a little over $1M and sewer about $2.4M in certified retained earnings, which can only be spent on their own enterprise. Most free cash comes from conservatively budgeted fees and non-property-tax revenue, with about $1M in department turnbacks. The group also covered encumbrances, revolving-fund thresholds and the stabilization funds.

On the draft capital plan, Andrew Golas and the finance staff said the roughly $210K Bay Mountain Farm APR item has been pulled from the plan pending further due diligence with the state and the committee, including statute-of-limitations questions. After the Select Board heard the senior center feasibility consultants, the plan was reworked: the $75K police-station parking-lot engineering item comes out, $500K is requested for a senior center design/feasibility study on the Masonic Home Road site next to the police station (new construction instead of an ~$11.2M renovation, with shared parking benefits for the police), and stabilization contributions drop to about $150K total ($100K regular, $50K capital), leaving about $900K of free cash for snow and ice and spring needs. Member Jamie voiced reservations about the stacked costs of this project and the school projects; after discussion that the study would be its own article and that spending it does not commit the town to build, the committee voted unanimously by roll call (3 in the room, 3 remote) to support Article 5 of the draft warrant. Timing discussion suggested a debt-exclusion vote no earlier than May 2028, and staff noted the town's AA+ bond rating, planning rates of 4-5% against recent 3% borrowing, and the 10% stabilization policy (currently about 12.47% of the FY27 budget).

On schools, staff explained the September 29 district ballot vote on the roughly $11M DCRSD $11.1M School Capital Request (about $6M Charlton share across Shepherd Hill and the two Charlton schools): it is a combined district vote, so if it passes Charlton is assessed regardless of a local debt exclusion, which staff urged the town to seek in May; the first assessment would likely hit FY29. They also reported that MSBA will decide December 9 whether to invite Heritage School into its program (decision on grades needed before October 2; 270 days after invitation to form a building committee and fund a feasibility study of roughly $1M; this one would be 100% a Charlton borrowing). Staff described the target tax-bill increase (about 3.5%, roughly $180 on the average single-family bill; about $2M of excess levy capacity exists but is not planned to be used), and the committee responded to a member's request for a clear "maximum increase" message for residents.

Finally, the fire chief's renewed request for a fire inspector and a police request for a second lieutenant were discussed; the committee agreed to a "not right now" and to revisit both during the FY28 budget cycle (January-March hearings), citing long-term benefit costs, the school-assessment shift and less new growth than hoped. The committee will meet jointly with the Select Board the following Tuesday to support or oppose warrant articles ahead of the October 19 town meeting, and asked that the first budget meeting start at 6:45. The meeting adjourned unanimously.

Issues discussed: Senior Community Center Feasibility, DCRSD $11.1M School Capital Request, Bay Mountain Farm APR Violation, Heritage School MSBA Process, Free Cash and FY27 Capital Plan, Fire Inspector and Police Lieutenant Staffing Requests

Transcript

0:06 | It's 6:35.
0:09 | Our first item on the agenda
0:10 | reporting in progress.
0:12 | Our first item on the agenda is the
0:14 | approval of last meetings minutes.
0:19 | All three of the So, we're going to
0:21 | approve the February, the April, and the
0:23 | May meetings. They're all in the folder.
0:26 | I hope everybody's had a chance to read
0:28 | them and review them. And to start with,
0:30 | I'll entertain a motion to accept the
0:34 | February 25th minute meeting minutes.
0:38 | A motion.
0:38 | I have a motion.
0:40 | And I have a second.
0:42 | Any discussion?
0:44 | There being none, all those in favor say
0:46 | yes.
0:46 | Yes.
0:49 | Yes.
0:50 | Yeah. I got Yep. Three yeses and one
0:52 | abstension of four yeses and one
0:55 | abstension. I'm sorry. So that is a
0:57 | vote. Next, I will entertain a motion to
1:00 | approve the April 28th meeting minutes.
1:03 | Make a motion.
1:04 | I have a motion.
1:06 | Second.
1:06 | I have a second. Any further discussion?
1:10 | There being none, all those in favor of
1:12 | approving say yes.
1:14 | Yes.
1:14 | Yes. Yes. Jamie Christian
1:17 | abstain. So, we have four yeses and one
1:20 | abstain.
1:21 | Next, I'll entertain a motion to approve
1:23 | the minutes of the May 18th meeting.
1:27 | Make a motion. I have a motion.
1:29 | Second.
1:30 | I have a second.
1:32 | Any discussion?
1:34 | All those in favor, please say yes.
1:37 | Yes.
1:37 | Yes.
1:38 | Yes.
1:39 | Four yeses and one abstension. [snorts]
1:42 | That is a vote. All right. Next on the
1:44 | agenda, grab your copy of the free cash
1:47 | statements. We're going to go through
1:48 | and
1:50 | talk about our free cash.
1:51 | I might have forgot to put stuff in the
1:52 | drop box, but I think I emailed you guys
1:54 | the free cash
1:56 | we got. packets.
2:01 | All right. So, let's go through free
2:03 | cash. How how you know I was looking for
2:06 | a topic to talk about at this meeting.
2:08 | So, let's take five minutes first to
2:10 | talk about how you determine what free
2:12 | cash is and how it's what it means to be
2:14 | certified.
2:15 | Okay. So once the year is all closed out
2:19 | and we had our final AP and payroll
2:21 | warrants and everything, I go through
2:23 | and put together a balance sheet with
2:25 | all of our general fund and then all of
2:28 | our grants, donations, um, agency funds,
2:32 | like any any fund that the town has
2:34 | custody of, I go through and I put
2:35 | together a balance sheet for everything.
2:37 | And then from there, um, I have a format
2:41 | and I have to put into the state's
2:42 | format to do that. Once it's all
2:44 | balanced and reconciled, and I've gone
2:46 | through and looked at accounts that are
2:47 | in the negative, make sure that
2:48 | nothing's incorrect or was uh like if
2:51 | something was accidentally coded to the
2:53 | wrong GL account or um uh if just things
2:57 | weren't put in the right places because
2:59 | sometimes that happens. I'll ask like
3:00 | departments, hey, are you expecting your
3:02 | grant to be this negative or are you
3:04 | expecting money back like and things
3:06 | like that. So, I'll work with some of
3:07 | the admins in the uh departments that
3:10 | have grants and we'll go through and
3:11 | we'll reconcile just to make sure if I
3:13 | do have negative grants that they're
3:14 | actually negative and then if they're
3:15 | not supposed to be negative to find out
3:17 | kind of like where the money went. Did
3:18 | it get coded somewhere wrong? Do all
3:20 | that stuff and then I put together this
3:23 | in the state format and we submit it to
3:24 | the state and then once it goes to the
3:26 | state, the state does their thing and
3:27 | they usually have questions about what
3:29 | things are and then they certify free
3:31 | cash. So it's a long process of looking
3:34 | at a lot of things um and putting
3:37 | everything in a format because our
3:39 | accounting software does not do that. I
3:40 | have to do it all manually. Um so
3:43 | basically what they do is they take
3:45 | everything that was essentially
3:48 | collected less your turnbacks or plus
3:51 | your turnbacks from whatever you didn't
3:53 | expend from your expenditure budget more
3:56 | or less. And that gets you what you see
3:57 | on the very top of the first page there.
3:59 | It says unreserved undesated fund
4:02 | balance. So it's like $6 million. So
4:04 | it's just kind of like a rolling balance
4:06 | every year
4:07 | and everything rolls up into there. So
4:09 | like your revenues obviously add to that
4:11 | number. Your expenditures take away from
4:13 | that number and then from there they
4:15 | take out what you have outstanding for
4:18 | property tax receivables and real estate
4:20 | receivables. So that's everything that
4:22 | we haven't collected on for current year
4:26 | just for those two. doesn't include
4:28 | motor vehicle, boat or uh tax title or
4:32 | any of that. So that this is all like
4:33 | current year that isn't in tax title. So
4:35 | like it's usually like 20 it'd be like
4:37 | 26 25 and probably part of 24.
4:42 | So anything that we haven't put into tax
4:44 | title. So that's all of our outstanding
4:46 | uh receivable at the moment. And then
4:49 | from there, if in a perfect world we
4:51 | didn't have any negative or deficit
4:52 | grants, that number would essentially
4:55 | get you what your free cash is. But
4:57 | because we had
4:59 | a bunch of grants that were in deficit,
5:02 | they essentially those are hits against
5:05 | your free cash number, assuming the
5:09 | state basically assumes that you're not
5:10 | going to collect on these. So you would
5:12 | have to fund them somehow,
5:15 | but at some point we would collect from
5:17 | these. They just assume you wouldn't
5:18 | because they have to assume that because
5:20 | if you didn't collect on them for some
5:21 | reason or something was classified wrong
5:23 | and I missed it,
5:25 | we would have to make that balance up
5:27 | somewhere.
5:28 | All right. So, so take the the first
5:29 | one, the DEA task force, $258.
5:32 | Yeah. Right. So, that's saying that they
5:35 | gave us $258.
5:37 | So, that's basically saying that between
5:39 | what we expended and what the state has
5:40 | reimbured us for, we're negative $258
5:44 | still.
5:44 | Okay. So, we overspent the grant.
5:46 | Correct. Yeah. So these aren't negative,
5:48 | but these are all def. So all of these
5:50 | grants should be negative. They're all
5:51 | negative numbers. So whatever the number
5:53 | is there, those are all what we're in
5:54 | deficit of
5:56 | on all of those grants.
6:00 | So $281,000
6:02 | correct is what we're deficit on.
6:04 | Correct.
6:05 | And we have to make that money up.
6:07 | Correct.
6:08 | Okay.
6:08 | So usually it's timing of grants coming
6:10 | in or like some of this like you see
6:13 | police outside detail billing. That's
6:15 | just like we've we've paid payroll out
6:18 | for details because we can't not pay a
6:20 | police officer if they do a detail or a
6:21 | traffic officer. We're waiting to be
6:23 | refunded.
6:24 | A department overspending correct
6:26 | budget.
6:26 | It's just that we haven't gotten
6:27 | reimbursed for the grant yet. Yes.
6:30 | So it's like time. It's just a lot of
6:31 | it's timing.
6:32 | So like if you see like we had a big hit
6:34 | for green communities, we're waiting for
6:36 | the state to refund us. It's just slow.
6:38 | Right. We had a we had a grant for it.
6:40 | We expended the grant funds.
6:42 | The state is has already stated that
6:45 | they've released the funds, but it
6:47 | hasn't hit our it didn't hit our bank
6:48 | account before Ashley closed, right?
6:51 | We have to account for this now because
6:53 | what if we did not get that right to
6:55 | that point.
6:56 | That's basically what get as a hit
6:58 | against our certified free cash. So,
7:00 | next year we'll have that grant funding,
7:02 | you know, it's probably already hit our
7:03 | bank at this point.
7:04 | Yeah, probably.
7:05 | So, when we reertify for next year,
7:08 | that'll show as a as a net surplus,
7:11 | right?
7:11 | Gotcha. Okay. So they basically they
7:13 | have to assume that you're not going to
7:15 | collect on it because they can't assume
7:17 | that you're going to because if they did
7:19 | and they certified your free cash higher
7:22 | and next year you don't collect on that
7:23 | then
7:24 | right
7:24 | you could end up in a situation.
7:26 | So that's the same as going back to that
7:27 | real estate tax receivable.
7:29 | We're going to get that money. We just
7:31 | don't have it. But we have to account
7:32 | for the fact that hey
7:34 | you may not get it.
7:35 | Right. It's basically a liability on
7:36 | your books. So, you have to just account
7:38 | that you're going to have to pay it at
7:39 | some point. Or in this case, like what
7:42 | if we never collected on that real
7:44 | estate? We budget based on collecting
7:46 | 100% of our real estate, but we don't
7:48 | always collect 100%. Right.
7:49 | I got you.
7:50 | And then if you turn to the back page,
7:53 | um
7:54 | they basically offset whatever your
7:57 | deferred revenue is. So that's your
8:02 | your personal property and real estate
8:05 | plus whatever is sitting in your overlay
8:07 | account. So your allowance for
8:09 | abatements. So basically we have a sum
8:11 | money sitting in that account for people
8:13 | to come back. So if we have to give you
8:14 | an abatement on your property tax cuz
8:16 | let's say you come to us and say my
8:19 | house is worth less so come give me come
8:22 | into my house and give me a new
8:23 | assessment
8:24 | and we would have to lower your real
8:25 | estate bill because your house your
8:27 | value was less than what we valued it
8:28 | at.
8:29 | We would take the money out of this
8:30 | account. So that's what that's sitting
8:32 | there.
8:33 | So they do a formula of all that and
8:35 | then they end up with a free cash
8:36 | balance of the 2.8 million.
8:38 | Right. So that was the number that I
8:39 | could not figure out how to come to that
8:41 | number. All right. looking at the number
8:43 | over here minus the number over here
8:45 | minus this number. I couldn't figure out
8:47 | how did you come up with 2.
8:48 | Yeah. So, it's the 6 million minus the
8:51 | combination of the 33 and the 698,000
8:54 | minus the 281,000
8:57 | minus the 2.4 million gets you to 2.8.
9:00 | Did I? Okay. Then I must have messed it
9:01 | up. All right. But that's how you get
9:02 | it.
9:03 | Yep.
9:03 | I gotcha.
9:04 | So that's for our free cash. And then
9:07 | they also obviously I have to do the
9:09 | same process when I do water and sewer.
9:11 | So that's what the other two pages are.
9:13 | They're certified retained earnings, so
9:16 | it's not called free cash. And
9:17 | essentially, they get the same thing.
9:19 | They just don't have usually grants. So
9:22 | they don't get it's the calculated the
9:24 | same way, but they look at different
9:25 | things for water and sewer because it's
9:28 | they don't have grant money going in and
9:29 | out like we do.
9:30 | So theirs came in, water came in at one
9:32 | a little over a million, and sewers came
9:34 | in at like 2.4.
9:36 | Yeah.
9:37 | So that's how we get to that number.
9:39 | Yep.
9:40 | All right. free cash number.
9:41 | Uh to get into the weeds just a little
9:44 | bit, what compromise or what comprises
9:47 | that 2.8, right? Is it mostly uh under
9:52 | expenditures by departments? Is it over
9:55 | grants that we get? Is it fees that we
9:58 | collect on?
9:58 | It was mostly fees that we collect that
10:00 | we don't that we don't
10:03 | account for budget,
10:04 | right?
10:04 | So like we underbudget for motor
10:07 | vehicle, we underbudget for
10:10 | fees, permits,
10:12 | pretty much any of our any of our
10:14 | revenue outside of property tax.
10:17 | We
10:17 | am receipts in this number.
10:19 | Um, no.
10:20 | Okay.
10:21 | Um, so we essentially under budget for
10:24 | things of like, uh, meals tax, um,
10:28 | cannabis tax,
10:31 | permits fees,
10:33 | the anything that I can't really like
10:35 | say because those are all
10:38 | um, very very
10:39 | they're very right. So like court fees
10:42 | are in there. So like I can't say like
10:43 | what happens if our court officer
10:44 | doesn't go to court because she's out
10:45 | for three months or something because
10:46 | she got injured or something like I
10:48 | can't account for that revenue. So we
10:49 | always budget on the lower end anyway.
10:52 | And when we set our tax rate I can only
10:56 | increase those fees by so much every
10:58 | year. I can only go plus or minus 20%
11:00 | per do rules unless I have a really
11:02 | really good explanation. Um
11:06 | and
11:07 | we've always been under like
11:09 | underbudgeted them because we've always
11:10 | been conservative.
11:12 | The revenue side
11:13 | it's mostly right revenue.
11:15 | How how much would you say of that is
11:18 | coming from
11:20 | non-spending by the the town
11:23 | departments.
11:24 | I think total I had like around a
11:26 | million in turnbacks.
11:28 | Okay. That's what I was wondering what
11:30 | the ratio was between, you know, under
11:32 | revenue projections, right, versus what
11:34 | the
11:35 | because I know the departments have
11:36 | always done very well here and not
11:38 | overspending or
11:40 | right
11:41 | they're doing and I just want to always
11:43 | have in the back of my head, okay, yeah,
11:45 | the police department does this and the
11:47 | fire department does that. They don't
11:48 | overbudget. They don't overspend their
11:50 | budgets,
11:50 | right? Yeah, they can't overspend their
11:52 | budget. I know they can't. Okay, but
11:54 | so they did.
11:55 | How many places spend right to the last
11:57 | penny? Okay, these these guys don't they
11:59 | spend what, you know, it seems like they
12:01 | spend what they need.
12:01 | Yeah, a lot of our department heads
12:03 | don't spend right to the penny.
12:04 | Um, a lot of them will come to me at the
12:06 | end of the year and say, "Hey, I have
12:08 | some money left. Could I do this?"
12:10 | And usually it's stuff on the capital
12:12 | list or
12:13 | like small capital projects that
12:15 | technically wouldn't qualify to come
12:17 | onto our capital because they're like
12:19 | maybe like three or four grand. So, they
12:21 | would they come to me and they'll say,
12:23 | "Hey, do you mind if I could I do this?"
12:24 | And it's usually I usually say yes
12:26 | because they saved me money somewhere
12:27 | else.
12:28 | Yeah.
12:28 | So,
12:29 | okay.
12:31 | So, that means we have 2 point I got to
12:33 | get my glasses.
12:34 | Yeah. 2.8. 2.8.
12:35 | 2.8
12:37 | this year, which I think is an all-time
12:39 | record.
12:39 | Well, it's actually No, I think two
12:41 | years ago was our
12:42 | was our record amount. We had a little
12:44 | over three. This is actually within 1%
12:47 | of what we had last year.
12:48 | Okay.
12:51 | All right. Good.
12:53 | 2.8. Any
12:56 | any questions of the two of them?
12:59 | Christian, Jamie, any questions on
13:02 | No.
13:03 | On this?
13:04 | No, I appreciate the explanation.
13:06 | Okay.
13:06 | I do have a quick question if you don't
13:08 | mind and I ask it. Um,
13:09 | that's why we have these meetings.
13:11 | So, let's say that the police department
13:13 | has a budget of 2 million and they spend
13:15 | 1.5 million. You said something about a
13:17 | turnback and I apologize. I'm the term
13:20 | seems self-explanatory, but they don't
13:22 | roll into the next budget year with a
13:24 | Oh,
13:25 | no. So any budgeted account items have
13:28 | to close out at the end of the year
13:29 | unless they're we what we call an
13:31 | incumbrance. So they can essentially,
13:34 | for lack of better terms, save the money
13:36 | into next fiscal year, but it has to be
13:38 | for items that they
13:40 | committed to
13:41 | committed to buying by June 30th. So
13:44 | whether they bought it and just didn't
13:45 | get an invoice or they had like a signed
13:47 | contract for doing let's just say they
13:49 | like they just did work outside PD they
13:51 | put stone down and put some protective
13:54 | barriers up so people can't crash
13:56 | through the PD um like things like that.
13:59 | So they had a signed contract to do that
14:00 | work before June 30th but they just
14:03 | didn't get the work done so we didn't
14:04 | have an invoice to pay so they can
14:06 | encumber for it. So that is the only
14:08 | thing that doesn't get essentially so
14:10 | that number gets rolled into their FY27
14:12 | budget. Um but everything else has to
14:15 | get closed out at the as of June 30th.
14:18 | So they start fresh with the new budget
14:19 | for July.
14:20 | It gets rolled in as a separate line
14:22 | too. So it's not like it it's a cost
14:24 | plus. It's you've committed this money
14:26 | to the specific purchase and then once
14:28 | that purchase is made it zeros out that
14:30 | account. They can't spend that on
14:31 | anything else.
14:31 | Right. Yeah. They are only they are um
14:33 | we do what we purchase orders for them.
14:35 | So they are
14:37 | married basically to that vendor for
14:39 | that dollar amount only. And if so,
14:41 | let's just say they said that they
14:42 | encumbered $1,000 and it only ended up
14:44 | costing them 500, they can't go and
14:46 | spend the extra 500 on something else.
14:48 | That will essentially close in the next
14:49 | fiscal year. They can only spend it to
14:51 | that vendor for that specific purpose.
14:53 | Awesome. Okay. Thank you for that.
14:54 | You're welcome. [clears throat]
14:56 | That's probably what gives town meeting
14:59 | control over their budget because they
15:01 | can't just say, "Well, I'll save it."
15:03 | Right.
15:04 | Right.
15:04 | So, the only
15:06 | I guess not really. So the only people
15:07 | that I guess really get to keep their
15:09 | money at the end and it isn't really
15:11 | even keeping it is water and sewer
15:13 | because they'll so their retained
15:15 | earnings can only be spent for water and
15:17 | sewer purposes individually. So
15:19 | essentially they keep their money
15:22 | because sewer keeps sewer water keeps
15:24 | water whereas the town free cash is for
15:26 | all of the departments.
15:28 | Okay. So essentially water and sewer
15:29 | could not spend their entire budget say
15:31 | hey I want to keep this and then wait
15:34 | for retained earnings to be certified
15:35 | and then they could spend it on a
15:36 | capital project
15:37 | but it has to be water and sewer
15:39 | correct only for water and sewer. Yeah
15:40 | they can only spend their money for
15:42 | their because that's all rateayer money
15:44 | they keep water and water and sewer and
15:46 | sewer they can't
15:47 | right they can't intermingle so like
15:49 | we all say water and sewer but it's too
15:51 | separate.
15:52 | Yeah. So sewer couldn't say, "Hey, water
15:54 | has an extra million. We need it to put
15:55 | a new pipe in."
15:56 | Interesting.
15:57 | Water has water keeps water money. Sewer
15:59 | keeps sewer money.
16:00 | They don't play well together.
16:02 | Even though they're the same commission.
16:04 | Also, revolving funds are separate.
16:08 | Correct. So the only thing with
16:09 | revolving funds is all of the revolving
16:12 | funds have a threshold. So whatever if
16:15 | they're over that threshold, which we
16:16 | vote at town meeting every year,
16:18 | if they're over that threshold, that
16:20 | threshold gets closed to general fund.
16:22 | So, it's usually like all building
16:23 | permits every year gets turned back. Um,
16:26 | he usually turns back at usually at
16:27 | least 100,000, right?
16:29 | Obviously, in more current years, it's
16:31 | been quite a bit more than that because
16:32 | all the Amazon permits, but um all
16:35 | theirs all have thresholds and if they
16:37 | hit so like let's say their threshold is
16:38 | 10,000, but they have 20,000 as of June
16:41 | 30th. General fund takes 10,000 and then
16:43 | they keep their 10.
16:45 | Oh, wow.
16:45 | And if it's under that, obviously they
16:47 | keep whatever is under that. I wouldn't
16:48 | take.
16:49 | It's almost like they keep a petty cash
16:50 | box
16:51 | kind of. Yeah.
16:51 | In each department.
16:53 | Yeah.
16:53 | To work on.
16:53 | And then like your receipts reserved for
16:55 | appropriation that you see your RFAS at
16:57 | town meeting. They keep all of their
16:58 | money. That can only be spent at town
17:01 | meeting.
17:02 | I did not realize it. Thank you.
17:03 | Yeah.
17:05 | Now that we know how much money is in
17:07 | the piggy bank. Okay. Let's move to the
17:10 | next one which is the draft capital plan
17:12 | and a prioritization of requests and an
17:16 | opa operational request. All right.
17:18 | So I apologize to Christian Kristen and
17:21 | Jamie because I didn't put this
17:23 | the paper plan you guys have in front of
17:25 | you in the Dropbox.
17:26 | It's just a fancier version. I'll drop
17:27 | it in later of the Excel spreadsheet
17:30 | that was in last our last meetings. It's
17:33 | this is just fancier.
17:36 | Um,
17:37 | just let me just explain something to
17:40 | Alicia. So, what we do with this is we
17:42 | we take a look at everything that
17:44 | they've proposed. Okay?
17:47 | It goes it it's part of the warrant. A
17:49 | lot of it's part of the warrant and then
17:51 | next week when we meet with the board of
17:52 | selectmen, we go article by article and
17:56 | we support it and they support it or we
17:58 | don't support it and they whatever.
18:00 | Okay. So this this meeting is more let's
18:03 | figure out where all the numbers are
18:05 | and then next week is when we do the
18:07 | actual approval.
18:08 | Okay.
18:09 | Thank you.
18:11 | All right.
18:12 | Off you go.
18:13 | So if we look at the paper that's in
18:15 | front of you or the spreadsheet, the top
18:18 | portion is all the current debt that we
18:19 | have um that is currently already voted
18:23 | and we're obligated to pay. So that's a
18:26 | total of the 1.69 million
18:28 | and that's already in the operational
18:29 | budget. So this is just as we're looking
18:31 | at the global capital plan. These are
18:33 | other capital
18:35 | um projects that have privacy been
18:38 | authorized but we're still obligated to
18:39 | pay on and try to look at it as what is
18:41 | our true capital
18:42 | outline.
18:44 | So if you go from there and then down to
18:47 | the next section those are all the
18:49 | requests that I have currently which are
18:51 | the same requests that you had in front
18:52 | of you at your at our last meeting. The
18:56 | two differences that I will note is we
18:58 | talked about um the Fay Mountain Farm
19:02 | money for the I keep wanting to call it
19:04 | ARPA, but it's not ARP,
19:08 | right?
19:08 | Yeah, APR.
19:09 | APR. Um, we're gonna hold off on that
19:12 | for now because we're not quite at the
19:14 | point of
19:18 | getting there yet where we still need to
19:20 | meet with the committee and we're trying
19:21 | to do some more due diligence with the
19:23 | state to figure out kind of where we are
19:25 | on that process.
19:26 | What is our true obligation here? I
19:28 | think that based off of just a singular
19:29 | conversation that happened between a me
19:31 | a person from the state and u a member
19:34 | of the committee isn't sufficient enough
19:36 | to say that we need to move forward at
19:37 | this time with anything until we engage
19:39 | in additional conversations about what
19:41 | is it what is it truly that we want to
19:45 | do with Fame Mountain and Farm? What
19:47 | what is the vision for over there? And
19:49 | is that vision something that may be
19:52 | workable with the state before we just
19:53 | go and say, "Yeah, we're willing to just
19:55 | cut a state check to the state for a
19:57 | certain amount of money because we
19:58 | didn't live up to a 25-year-old
20:00 | promise." But there's also questions
20:01 | about the um
20:04 | um you know, statute of limitations on
20:06 | the requirements of of that agreement
20:09 | that we need to work through as well.
20:10 | Right.
20:11 | So, too many whatifs to have it on the
20:13 | capital plan for now. So, we're going to
20:14 | hold off on that. So, so you're saying
20:16 | that the 210 is not
20:18 | correct. Yeah, we took it off.
20:20 | Um,
20:21 | you said you took it off, but it's still
20:22 | on my chart.
20:23 | Well, yes, it's on the chart that's in
20:25 | there, but it's not on the paper that's
20:27 | in front of you.
20:28 | Oh, all right. You know what? I'm
20:29 | looking.
20:29 | It's not in the fancy one, but it's on
20:31 | the one from last week. Yeah.
20:32 | Or last meeting. I keep
20:34 | the other side of this one.
20:35 | Yeah, it's not.
20:37 | Okay. So, you know what? [clears throat]
20:38 | You get rid of my PayPal
20:41 | and then
20:41 | looking at the wrong numbers. the I
20:44 | guess we kind of have if you want to
20:46 | call option A option B going. So in
20:49 | front of you you'll see that there was a
20:51 | um a an item on here for parking lot
20:54 | repaving for engineering for the police
20:56 | station for 75,000.
20:58 | Um
21:00 | at the board of selectman's last meeting
21:02 | the senior center feasibility study came
21:04 | to talk to them about putting the senior
21:06 | center on for town meeting and I can I
21:10 | guess Andrew can explain more. So, you
21:12 | know, essentially outline the different
21:13 | options that were, you know, that that
21:16 | the town could take relative to it based
21:18 | off of timelines and what seemed to have
21:20 | like I guess the most board support was
21:23 | to actually look at new construction and
21:26 | to look at the uh land that is at the
21:29 | what was slated to be at the former
21:31 | public safety building. So looking at
21:34 | kind of our our
21:36 | the way that we had attacked the fi the
21:38 | fire substation project and saying that
21:41 | okay the first you know really first
21:42 | step was feasibility the second step was
21:45 | schematic design and design development
21:47 | and putting some you know taking some
21:50 | free cash putting it toward that
21:52 | project. It's a healthy number but it
21:54 | gets you into that project. It gets you
21:56 | a building [snorts] design and it gives
21:58 | you a probably a 75%
22:00 | cost estimation as to what that cost
22:03 | would be
22:04 | and I think enough information to inform
22:06 | the voters on a potential on a on the
22:10 | cost of a project itself to fund. So by
22:14 | putting some real money toward it,
22:15 | designing that building, the next phase
22:17 | would be um the uh the contra the the
22:22 | actual construction document phase which
22:24 | is a little bit more intensive.
22:27 | Um but with that with that number, you
22:30 | could essentially sell the project. So
22:32 | you're kind of clearing a lower a a
22:35 | little bit of a higher hurdle um by
22:37 | asking for a good amount of money.
22:38 | Hopefully, you don't have to spend all
22:40 | that money because if you come up with
22:42 | your all your schematic design plans and
22:44 | you're under budget and the project gets
22:46 | approved, then the any money that's
22:48 | remaining could then go into the actual
22:50 | construction phase.
22:51 | So, at least it's it's committing the
22:54 | town to a path.
22:57 | And then our our game plan with that was
22:59 | because it's g if it
23:00 | if we're going to use the Masonic home
23:03 | road
23:04 | site, it's obviously right next to our
23:06 | current police station. If you could put
23:08 | the building close to the current police
23:10 | station, you could almost
23:12 | create ancillary parking
23:13 | parking for the police station because
23:15 | they need parking
23:16 | and then it would solve their parking
23:18 | problem
23:19 | and then also give the seniors a
23:21 | building. So we could use
23:23 | kind you're kind of I guess killing two
23:24 | birds with one stone sense. So instead
23:26 | of engineering for parking lot redesign,
23:29 | if you're going to build a building over
23:30 | there, you might as well just add that
23:32 | in the parking one. So we would
23:35 | essentially take the 75,000 off the
23:38 | table for the police station parking lot
23:40 | repavement.
23:41 | Y
23:42 | that would then become 500,000 for
23:44 | senior center and this isn't on your
23:46 | paper but it would essentially become
23:48 | 500,000 for the senior center
23:50 | feasibility study and then further down
23:54 | um in your paper you see that we were
23:55 | putting money into stabilization. I
23:57 | would still do that, but instead of the
23:58 | 250 into regular stabilization and the
24:01 | 300 into capital, I would do either a
24:04 | hundred into regular and 50 into
24:05 | capital, or you could flip-flop it, but
24:07 | I would essentially only do 150,000. And
24:11 | that would in turn leave us with like a
24:12 | little over $900,000 in free cash.
24:15 | It'd be like a 900 whatever. So, we're
24:18 | at 925 right now. It'd be like nine
24:21 | right at the $900,000 mark or so.
24:25 | What what's our 10% number? Our
24:28 | stabilization.
24:29 | So, we're we're already currently at 12.
24:32 | What do I have it here?
24:33 | We're over 10.
24:34 | Yeah, we're at 12 right now. We're
24:36 | currently at 12.47 of the current FY27
24:39 | operating budget.
24:40 | So, we're over 10.
24:42 | So, I would still be putting money aside
24:44 | because we didn't get to do that last
24:45 | year. So, we would put money aside still
24:47 | this year and still get the senior
24:49 | center study done and still leave money
24:51 | sitting in free cash for the spring for
24:54 | any um needed capital projects if we
24:58 | have it. And then we always obviously
24:59 | save it for snow and ice.
25:00 | Yep.
25:01 | Right.
25:01 | So, we would still leave ourselves with
25:03 | almost the million-dollar cushion which
25:05 | we try. And this this used to confuse me
25:07 | just to make sure that we all everybody
25:09 | knows there's a difference between free
25:11 | cash certified free cash and free cash
25:14 | that you're using as a term. Okay.
25:17 | That's available to us down the road.
25:19 | Well, no, that would in my really the
25:22 | same dollars.
25:23 | Yes. So the 2 you have 2.8 2.8 million
25:26 | that was certified, right?
25:27 | You can only you have that money to
25:29 | spend until June 30th, right? Once June
25:31 | 30th hit that that money goes away and
25:33 | you have to wait for it to get
25:34 | reertified again for FY28.
25:36 | So we're allocating 1.9 now.
25:38 | Correct.
25:39 | 1
25:40 | 1.9
25:42 | whatever the rough numbers.
25:43 | Yeah.
25:44 | 1.9 with
25:46 | and you're going to leave like 900,000
25:47 | on the table. Y got
25:49 | and then that money we could roll would
25:52 | stay until the spring at our next town
25:54 | meeting
25:55 | and then we could vote from we usually
25:57 | vote from there to fund if there is a
26:00 | snow and ice deficit [clears throat]
26:01 | rather than raising that on the recap
26:03 | for taxes. So we spend that from free
26:05 | cash and then if we had any capital
26:09 | projects that came up or emergencies or
26:10 | whatever that could wait until May that
26:12 | we needed to do, we could spend the rest
26:14 | of that or just let it essentially
26:17 | close. we don't spend it and then it
26:18 | becomes part of free cash for the next
26:19 | year.
26:20 | Gotcha. Now I noticed that you were 300
26:23 | on capital and 250 on stabilization. Do
26:26 | you have was your ratio there because
26:28 | you know you got some capital stuff
26:30 | coming?
26:32 | I think our game plan is yeah we also
26:34 | didn't put any money toward capital last
26:36 | year. Um, so we we want to try we we had
26:40 | really rated our capital stabiliz I say
26:42 | rated but you know we took a healthy
26:43 | balance out of our capital stabilization
26:45 | account back when we did the fire
26:46 | station project
26:47 | and we did recover some of that money
26:50 | into there through taxation
26:52 | u two years ago to kind of bring us back
26:55 | to that million dollar mark but we
26:57 | really haven't um contributed to it. We
27:01 | like to get it back up. Uh there is
27:03 | another project that we'll want to talk
27:04 | about that we that we discussed today.
27:06 | That may be another thing that we'll
27:08 | have to look at capital stabilization if
27:11 | uh timing comes in spring. Right. So
27:13 | all right. So if we take that 250 and
27:17 | and you said bring it down to 100.
27:19 | Yeah. So essentially you could do 100
27:21 | into stabilization, 50 into capital, or
27:23 | if you really wanted to flip-flop them,
27:24 | you can. And you have 150,000 to spend
27:27 | either
27:28 | right
27:28 | either way. And that then frees up the
27:31 | senior center of money.
27:32 | Correct.
27:32 | Half million dollars.
27:33 | Correct.
27:37 | All right. And then sewer and sewer. We
27:39 | don't
27:39 | Yeah. Sewer and water. Those were
27:40 | requests from the water and sewer
27:41 | commissioners. And then you'll also see
27:44 | uh what you didn't see at your last
27:45 | meeting, there's a $25,000
27:47 | office renovations for the sewer
27:50 | facility um that got added because they
27:52 | just voted on that at their last
27:53 | meeting.
27:54 | Yep.
27:54 | So that's obviously going to come from
27:55 | sewer retained earnings.
27:57 | Okay.
27:59 | So you can you redo this with
28:02 | Yes. Yep. I I wanted to get a feel from
28:04 | you guys first because the other thing
28:06 | is is um I think the select board kind
28:09 | of wants your seal of approval on that
28:12 | if that's how you guys want to move
28:13 | forward before
28:14 | you senior.
28:15 | Yes. I think before we switch it because
28:18 | then I would in the warrant that way but
28:21 | it's not on your capital plan that way.
28:23 | So I can the warrant's okay.
28:25 | You want a formalized motion? the
28:27 | warrant. Uh, yeah, it would probably be
28:29 | nice.
28:29 | All right. Can we hold on? Can we talk
28:31 | about that a little bit more? I feel
28:32 | like I feel like this this came on
28:34 | pretty quick and I like I'm not fully
28:36 | understand. So,
28:38 | the request is 500K and it's in the
28:42 | warrant already.
28:43 | It's in a draft.
28:45 | It's in the draft warrant, right? And
28:46 | it's not it's not the warrant for
28:48 | posting. It's it's the it's the booklet
28:50 | version of how we outlay it.
28:52 | No, I know. So if you look at article
28:55 | five. So article four if you if we want
28:57 | to look at it really quick has all the
28:58 | obviously all the separate motions.
29:00 | Yeah.
29:01 | Those are all the capital
29:02 | right besides
29:03 | requests that are in that were that we
29:05 | talked about last meeting aside from the
29:07 | $75,000.
29:09 | Actually I lied. The $75,000 is in here
29:11 | but I would take that out if you guys
29:13 | want to move forward with article five
29:14 | which is the senior center design
29:17 | feasibility study. So that's where the
29:18 | $500,000 is sitting currently. And it
29:21 | has nothing this has nothing to do with
29:23 | the the location we had previously
29:25 | talked about. This is a new location and
29:28 | a new idea.
29:29 | Correct.
29:29 | Coming out of the select board.
29:32 | Yes. So I think the way that we would
29:33 | move forward is if we're going to do it,
29:35 | we would look at just doing it at the
29:38 | Masonic home road location. Essentially
29:40 | what it came out to was that as they
29:42 | looked at the other location,
29:44 | the comparative cost of renovation and
29:48 | acquisition of the property was
29:50 | equivalent to new build for the same
29:53 | square footage.
29:55 | So
29:56 | yet either whether you chose down there
29:59 | or built brand new on an unknown on an
30:02 | unknown site, you were generally talking
30:04 | about the same the same dollars. and
30:06 | they felt that by pursuing that property
30:11 | for a new build was a much more tenable
30:14 | idea than to try to do an do an 11
30:18 | million renovation on a prop uh on a
30:21 | property.
30:22 | Okay. And we spent 75k I believe on the
30:26 | previous
30:27 | 50 on the previous on whatever what we
30:30 | last year.
30:30 | 50. And what they did was they compare
30:32 | that what they did was do a do a
30:34 | building analysis and comparative. So
30:38 | they analyzed the
30:41 | um cost it would be for renovation to
30:44 | that building. They looked at this
30:46 | building to see what would it exp what
30:48 | would it the constraints beyond
30:50 | expansion of this building. So to
30:53 | essentially achieve similar so almost
30:56 | connecting the two wings over here and
30:58 | trying to provide additional parking and
31:01 | the costs were comparable but the the
31:03 | constraints of trying to develop it and
31:05 | the the final product was not
31:09 | didn't really pan out. And then compared
31:12 | to to those two was unknown site. We're
31:15 | not selecting any particular site, but
31:17 | based off the current cost per square
31:19 | footage for new construction, what would
31:21 | a similar size building cost? It was
31:24 | generally pretty much the same, 11,
31:27 | you know, 11.2 million, give or take.
31:30 | Um, either way,
31:32 | okay. And this new 500k
31:37 | will basically set us up like we did
31:39 | with the fire station with this is like
31:42 | a full feas feasibility with designs for
31:45 | that other location and to get us to a
31:48 | point where we pretty much know exactly
31:50 | what it's going to cost in order to do
31:52 | that.
31:53 | What it's going to look like then you'd
31:55 | have a more hard concrete number to go
31:57 | to town meeting to approve a project.
31:59 | And then if we we're going to go for a
32:01 | debt exclusion, you could also go for
32:02 | that too,
32:03 | which which would happen in May. So
32:05 | basically we're we're
32:07 | not even this May.
32:09 | Not even this.
32:09 | You like to because really if this is
32:12 | approved,
32:12 | good question.
32:13 | You have to hire an OPM and architect.
32:17 | You need to go you need to do all your
32:19 | due diligence. You have to design this
32:20 | building. I mean, you're probably
32:21 | talking at least eight months worth of
32:23 | work that they're going to have to do to
32:25 | develop this plan. working with a build
32:28 | with a with a building committee to to
32:30 | develop this. So, realistically, if it's
32:33 | approved in
32:35 | October, you're probably talking
32:38 | next October,
32:41 | close to next October that you might
32:42 | even be ready to take a next step, but
32:45 | you also have to pair that with
32:47 | a debt exclusion vote, right? So you may
32:50 | you know then we're going to talk you
32:52 | know then the next discussion will be
32:53 | about timing of a town meeting pro you
32:56 | know town meeting approval of the
32:57 | project then debt exclusion of of a
32:59 | project
33:00 | right
33:01 | question
33:01 | and see there's no I'm sorry to
33:04 | interrupt I was just going to say and
33:05 | and there's no state or federal
33:07 | elections next November so that's
33:09 | grading the following
33:10 | May so there are well there's not
33:13 | but even if there were it's hard to you
33:15 | have to have all your ducks in a row
33:17 | what is it like 30 60 days prior
33:20 | to get on to. So they're hard
33:21 | saying there's no opportunity. So we're
33:23 | talking about the dead exclusion vote
33:25 | being sometime in
33:26 | May 28. Right.
33:28 | Right. Gota
33:29 | right and realistically you may need
33:30 | that time to try to
33:32 | say all right we've done this now we
33:34 | need to go to a due diligence period to
33:35 | really
33:36 | sell this. Right.
33:37 | Answer all the answer all the questions
33:39 | get all get all the tweaks
33:41 | worked out of it. You know get all the
33:43 | public feedback and then come back and
33:45 | make any changes that need to be made.
33:46 | And then like with the with the fire
33:49 | station, we actually put the debt
33:50 | exclusion vote
33:52 | before or the sorry the ballot vote
33:55 | before the town meeting vote. So we
33:57 | needed that,
33:58 | you know,
34:00 | that assurance. You know, it was kind of
34:01 | a
34:02 | wonky time frame that you're asking for
34:04 | approval on a project before you've ever
34:07 | authorized the debt to do it.
34:08 | Right.
34:10 | Now, if we spend the money for the PL
34:12 | I'm sorry, Jeremy.
34:12 | No,
34:13 | for the plan
34:15 | and it goes through and we agree to
34:18 | build new senior center, does the town,
34:20 | and I I apologize for not knowing this.
34:22 | Does the town have to do any kind of
34:23 | borrowing to put up the senior center?
34:25 | So, and the reason I ask is because from
34:27 | LA this time last year to this time this
34:29 | year, we're interest rates are up almost
34:32 | a single a full 1% on a borrowing. And
34:35 | that doesn't sound like much, but it is
34:37 | absurdly a lot when you get into the
34:39 | bigger numbers, right? Do we take into
34:41 | account just how much more expensive
34:43 | this project might be in another year or
34:44 | two as to where it would be when it
34:47 | first started getting discussed? I
34:48 | believe it was 5 years ago. I mean, we
34:50 | are in a vastly different rate
34:51 | environment and this project might start
34:54 | out at 10 million, might very well come
34:55 | into 15 to 20 million. And do we take
34:58 | into account any of that?
35:00 | Um, we try to. Um I as you remember with
35:02 | the fire station project, it was a very
35:05 | um
35:08 | a very
35:11 | weird time for the construction market
35:13 | where things were were going up
35:15 | significantly and we even saw [snorts]
35:17 | between when we did the feasibility
35:19 | study to when we ended schematic design,
35:21 | a $3 million escalation, the estimated
35:24 | uh cost. Thankfully, the bids did not
35:26 | come in that high. they came in actually
35:28 | closer to where where they were
35:29 | estimating at feasibility. But I think
35:31 | that you know that is a a consideration
35:34 | that they're that when they actually do
35:36 | estimate when they do the estimations
35:38 | you know professional cost estimators
35:40 | they'll say well what are you looking at
35:41 | doing construction? Okay. Well that at
35:44 | that time it's going to be this right
35:46 | and as you mentioned about the the uh
35:48 | interest rates that's why we're very
35:50 | aggressive with our stabilization and
35:51 | stuff to have the highest possible bond
35:53 | rating. Um, right now we're at a double
35:55 | A plus, you know, just under that AAA.
35:57 | And from all intents and purposes,
35:59 | everything that keeps us away from AAA
36:01 | is way is out of our control. Sure.
36:03 | So, we've done everything that we can to
36:05 | to have a solid double A double A plus
36:08 | for the best interest rate possible.
36:09 | So, when we use when we're looking at
36:11 | like looking at financing for things, we
36:14 | usually plan around the four and a half,
36:16 | four, four and a half, even 5% interest
36:18 | rate, and we've been borrowing at like
36:20 | three.
36:21 | Oh, wow. So, we usually plan for the
36:23 | worst, hope for the best.
36:24 | Yeah. And we're using these numbers to
36:26 | try to basically say that we're going to
36:27 | exclude this we're exclude the debt from
36:29 | this project. So, it's not going to
36:31 | impact our operational budget, but we
36:32 | understand that the long-term debt will
36:34 | be added to the tax bill,
36:36 | right?
36:36 | So,
36:37 | thank you.
36:39 | And we just borrowed at the 3% too.
36:40 | One of the reasons why I asked about are
36:42 | we over the 10% is because that's the
36:45 | state recommendation. And when you are,
36:48 | you get a better bond
36:48 | rate. Yeah. So,
36:50 | yeah, they look to see make sure that
36:51 | you're actually meeting your policy
36:52 | objectives,
36:53 | right? And in our policy, we have a 10%
36:55 | minimum basically in our stabilization
36:57 | balance. So, basically, they look at all
36:59 | of like our financial policies, make
37:00 | sure we're meeting all of those
37:01 | benchmarks and the finance committee
37:03 | goals. Make sure we're meeting those.
37:05 | And then they also now look at outside
37:07 | factors of economic growth and how much
37:09 | people that live in your community make
37:10 | and what um
37:12 | what their
37:13 | the Worcester County pension system
37:14 | which and the Worcester County pension
37:16 | system how how much they're funded for
37:18 | their OPED and it's like they're nowhere
37:21 | close. So we get dinged for all of those
37:23 | things and those things. So like our we
37:26 | meet our financial policies and do all
37:27 | that stuff that we can internally and
37:29 | we've worked really hard to do that but
37:30 | the outside factors and um are all out
37:33 | of our control. like the Worcester
37:35 | regional thing is always a big ding for
37:36 | us. And then the outside, we're just not
37:38 | obviously
37:40 | inside the 495 corridor. So, we're not
37:42 | as I guess we're just not in that
37:45 | wealthy belt. Even though we're doing
37:47 | well, we're just not in that belt where
37:49 | everyone usually is the AAA's.
37:50 | They look at county growth rates. So,
37:52 | essentially, we're being looked at in
37:54 | all of Worcester County. So even in the
37:56 | northern Worcester County area, they're
37:58 | basically saying, well, because, you
37:59 | know, the towns up, you know, in the
38:00 | north Worcester County area are
38:04 | affecting our growth down here in Charle
38:05 | because it's, you know, it's somebody in
38:07 | New York that's
38:08 | evaluating these.
38:10 | When you say growth, do you mean
38:11 | population or income?
38:12 | Both. Both. Okay. Okay.
38:14 | Population, income, economic
38:15 | development, uh, average, uh, me or
38:19 | median household income,
38:22 | you know. So,
38:23 | yeah,
38:24 | all those factors They look
38:25 | everything out of our control.
38:27 | Yeah. Sure.
38:27 | Look at every number.
38:29 | And they compare you to like Worcester
38:31 | and like big cities and obviously we're
38:33 | not a big city, but that's what they're
38:34 | comparing you to because you're inside
38:36 | the Worcester County.
38:37 | Sure.
38:38 | It's fun.
38:39 | Brian, Jamie, Christian, any questions
38:41 | on this uh budget on the um capital
38:45 | budget?
38:46 | And did you Good. Thank you.
38:48 | I actually just wanted to say we're all
38:51 | we're going to vote for is that it is
38:53 | going to be able to before town meeting.
38:56 | Correct.
38:56 | Correct.
38:57 | And then the town is going to be able to
38:58 | vote on this because I have some real um
39:02 | reservations about at least the
39:04 | acknowledgement that we have major
39:07 | financial
39:09 | commitments coming up with whatever we
39:11 | need to do for the existing school
39:12 | buildings and we're talking about a
39:15 | study for a new building. I'm not saying
39:19 | I don't think it's necessary to have a
39:21 | senior center and we have outgrown what
39:23 | we have. But I'm saying if we're trying
39:25 | to be fiscally responsible as a town or
39:28 | determine
39:30 | as residents what people can afford,
39:32 | they're going to have to weigh all all
39:34 | of these things out. And I just I would
39:36 | like to give them the option to weigh it
39:38 | out and like the vote, but I don't want
39:40 | to be the one responsible for making the
39:41 | decision that somebody can afford a new
39:43 | building.
39:44 | Right. Yep. No. And and that's that's
39:46 | the goal here, Jamie, is to give
39:48 | everybody the option, give them the
39:50 | ability to to to say yes or no. Right.
39:52 | Okay.
39:54 | Again, our job is to make sure that we
39:55 | can fit it within a fiscal policy that
39:58 | we we want to follow. All right.
40:00 | And again, I mean, obviously, it's
40:02 | $500,000. It's a lot of money, but just
40:04 | because we spend it doesn't mean you
40:05 | have to move forward with the building.
40:07 | You could get there and maybe cost
40:09 | escalations go really high or the town
40:11 | just decides they don't want to move
40:12 | forward with it. I mean, obviously you
40:13 | spent the 500,000, but at least it gave
40:15 | them that opportunity to see what the
40:17 | cost would be.
40:18 | But but to your point, Jamie,
40:19 | I guess to that exact point, Ashley, I I
40:22 | don't want to spend $500,000 if the
40:25 | citizens in the town are not going to
40:27 | vote to move forward on this. I feel
40:29 | like we could save the money now,
40:32 | right?
40:33 | If we know we would not have the backing
40:36 | of the of them, the voters.
40:40 | So that's why I think we left it as a
40:42 | separate article too because we did it
40:43 | with the fire station anyway. So it's
40:45 | separate from all the the that capital
40:49 | article even though it's like four
40:50 | different motions. It's separate from
40:51 | that. It's its own article, right? So it
40:53 | can get discussed at town meeting too.
40:55 | So if we're going to move forward with
40:57 | it, we are going to make it its own
40:58 | article.
40:59 | Yep. And that and that's the that's the
41:02 | whole reason Jamie just to give
41:03 | everybody the chance. All right. And and
41:05 | now next on the agenda, if there's no
41:07 | more questions, Brian, thanks for
41:08 | joining us. Do you have any questions on
41:10 | the capital plan is is presented?
41:13 | No, I think you guys covered everything.
41:15 | Okay, good.
41:16 | If we are if you guys are okay with
41:17 | doing the 500, can we just vote on it
41:20 | just so we have the seal of approval? I
41:22 | think the board
41:23 | we do have we did have the senior
41:24 | standard feasibility proposal down the
41:26 | agenda, but if you want to do it now.
41:28 | All right.
41:28 | I guess if you want to talk about the
41:29 | proposal, we can, but
41:32 | no, I'll make it as simple as possible.
41:35 | I'll entertain a motion that we support
41:37 | article five of the draft town warrant.
41:41 | And that basically just says for those
41:43 | at home because they are the ones that
41:44 | are on Zoom or that can't see it, it's
41:47 | just it's an article to allow us to
41:51 | obtain OPM to go for and uh basically
41:55 | allow us to go to the next phase for the
41:57 | $500,000 for the purpose of the senior
41:59 | center.
42:00 | And again, Jamie, we're we're approving
42:03 | the written article. We're not spending
42:06 | the money. Yeah.
42:06 | That's the town's job, right?
42:08 | Okay.
42:08 | And that would also change. So, if we're
42:10 | going
42:11 | and I guess maybe this is a question for
42:13 | you guys. So, if if that if we're going
42:14 | to do it, that's obviously going to
42:16 | change the uh stabilization numbers and
42:18 | get rid of the parking lot for the
42:20 | police station. [clears throat]
42:21 | And I made those. That's why I asked you
42:23 | if you're going to redo this. If the
42:25 | 500,000 I guess fails on the town
42:27 | meeting floor, did we want to change and
42:30 | bring stabilization back to what what is
42:32 | in front of you for the 250 and the 300?
42:35 | That would be
42:36 | Can I ask one more question before we
42:37 | vote?
42:37 | Yeah.
42:38 | So, if we vote to put this on the town
42:41 | warrant, I read looking at the back, are
42:45 | we then stating that we agree that not
42:47 | adding a police officer and a fire
42:49 | inspector is how we as a finance
42:51 | committee are going?
42:52 | That's separate.
42:53 | Okay.
42:54 | I haven't I haven't brought that up yet.
42:57 | I will do that next, but that would be
42:59 | separate from this.
43:00 | Oh, if we're not
43:01 | I had two requests for additional
43:02 | personnel come in.
43:05 | Do we have that the agenda to talk about
43:07 | operational?
43:08 | It's in under our update.
43:10 | Okay. See, plus that's an operational
43:12 | thing versus capital.
43:13 | Oh, so it's
43:15 | I just threw it in there because it came
43:16 | in as an ask for October's town meeting
43:19 | and I apologize again for not knowing. I
43:22 | thought it was one bucket of money and
43:23 | we had to decide what we were
43:24 | supporting. That will be separate.
43:26 | That's an operational.
43:27 | I know it's under capital plan update,
43:28 | but it's realistically that was that's a
43:30 | separate update that we wanted to
43:31 | address.
43:32 | Sorry.
43:32 | Afterward. It's okay.
43:33 | No, no, no.
43:34 | By you asking those kinds of questions.
43:36 | Okay. Everybody gets to understand how
43:38 | we operate.
43:39 | Okay.
43:39 | So, don't ever be afraid to ask the
43:41 | question, right?
43:43 | So, I didn't hear any further discussion
43:45 | from the three at home. Jeremy, you got
43:47 | anything? No. I just I was going to ask
43:49 | if you entertained a motion or you made
43:51 | a motion. No,
43:52 | I can't make a motion. I will entertain
43:54 | a motion to uh to support article five
43:58 | in the draft warrants.
44:00 | I'll make the I'll support the motion.
44:02 | All right. So, I have a motion. Do I
44:04 | have a second?
44:05 | I'll second. I have a second. Any
44:07 | further discussion?
44:11 | There being none, all those in favor say
44:13 | yes.
44:14 | Yes.
44:15 | Yes.
44:15 | Yes.
44:15 | Yes. Uh, do I have to do
44:18 | I'm sorry. I got to do roll call.
44:20 | Christian, yes or no?
44:22 | Yes.
44:23 | Brian, yes or no?
44:25 | Yes.
44:26 | Jamie, yes or no?
44:28 | Yes.
44:28 | All right. So, that's three there and
44:30 | three here. So, that's
44:32 | unanimous. So, we will support that
44:35 | motion.
44:36 | And then I guess my second portion is if
44:40 | for whatever reason if if this does make
44:42 | it through the because the board of
44:43 | selectman also has to put their seal
44:44 | approval on this. If they do and that
44:46 | 500,000 fails on the floor, do you want
44:49 | to change the amounts going into
44:50 | stabilization?
44:51 | Yeah, but by the time we do that
44:54 | article, we'll have already done
44:55 | the stabilization transfer is the
44:57 | article after.
44:58 | Oh,
44:58 | so you'd have to make a so on the floor
45:01 | make a motion to
45:03 | right
45:03 | as part of the motion that you make.
45:05 | You'd have to indicate that you're
45:07 | recommending a different amount. So what
45:09 | I'll do is when we do the whole articles
45:11 | out I will give you guys the
45:14 | stabilization transfer article. So if it
45:16 | does fail right
45:17 | if you want to we can change it on the
45:18 | floor.
45:19 | Gotcha. Yes.
45:20 | And what is stabilization do? What does
45:21 | that actually mean?
45:22 | So stabilization is basically for lack
45:24 | of better a rainy day fund. So it's a
45:27 | savings account that you need the
45:30 | majority of time to vote yes to put
45:32 | money into and then it needs twothirds
45:34 | vote to come out and you can only use
45:36 | it. So capital stabilization can only be
45:38 | used to capital purchases like cruisers
45:40 | or buildings or like capital items. You
45:43 | couldn't use it to fund a a body.
45:45 | Okay?
45:46 | I wouldn't recommend using any of these
45:47 | to fund a body, but capital capital
45:49 | stabilization can only be used for
45:50 | capital items. Stabilization could be
45:53 | used for anything. Okay?
45:54 | Our goal is to fund it to a level of of
45:56 | funding at least one year's worth of
45:58 | capital request. So that way if for some
46:00 | reason our free cash
46:02 | took a hit for for some unknown reason,
46:05 | we could actually defer back to our
46:06 | capital stabilization to continue our
46:08 | capital plan.
46:09 | Okay. Thank you.
46:12 | Yeah, I I would be in favor of adjusting
46:15 | that new mo the motion six.
46:17 | Okay. So what I'll do is when we do the
46:18 | motions at or the who's calling what at
46:21 | town meeting, I'll make sure that goes
46:22 | to you guys and then we can change on
46:23 | the floor if we need to.
46:24 | If we need to.
46:25 | Okay. So, I will be removing the police
46:28 | station parking lot. We're going to do
46:30 | the 500,000 for the senior center and
46:32 | then it would be 150 100 and then the 50
46:34 | to the two stabilization.
46:36 | Okay.
46:37 | So, we're good on that then.
46:41 | Yeah, that was the only that was the
46:42 | only change I had.
46:48 | All right. So, that's that's that. Uh
46:51 | so, now number five. Now Jamie, we get
46:53 | to talk about the schools and their
46:55 | votes coming up.
46:57 | Do you want to talk about our meeting
46:58 | today or
46:59 | uh Yeah. So we
47:00 | we have two we have two parts to the
47:02 | school.
47:03 | Oh,
47:03 | but you want to do the capital the
47:05 | ballot vote coming up first?
47:07 | Yeah, let's check. Yeah. So obviously we
47:09 | have the ballot vote that's coming up uh
47:10 | that's September 29th 29th. Um,
47:14 | essentially it's a 11 a little over 11
47:17 | million uh capital request from the
47:20 | school for a loan authorization. Loan
47:22 | authorization requires a ballot vote of
47:23 | the member towns. Um, if approved, the t
47:27 | the town has to decide how it's going to
47:29 | fund it. If it takes no further action,
47:30 | we have to try to figure out a way to
47:32 | fund it through our operational budget.
47:35 | So, I believe our our cost impact based
47:38 | off the capital plan is about $6 million
47:41 | for between our proportionate share of
47:43 | Shepherd Hill at the two Charlton
47:45 | schools of what's in that. Um, Dudley
47:48 | has opted that at the same meeting
47:50 | they're going to have that the ballot
47:53 | vote for the school, but also the debt
47:56 | exclusion vote on that on that school
47:58 | borrowing and an override vote.
48:01 | Obviously, we're not in that position
48:03 | that we need to consider all all three
48:04 | of those at once. But if it does pass,
48:08 | uh considering it's a $6 million
48:09 | project, I would implore the town to
48:12 | consider a uh debt excluding the town's
48:16 | portion of that in May. Um because we
48:19 | won't be in a position to obligate any
48:22 | funds and we'll see what the results of
48:24 | of that election are before we make a
48:27 | internal funding decision. And I don't
48:30 | think we would see I'd have to double
48:32 | check the information that we got from
48:34 | the school, but I don't think we would
48:36 | even see it in the FY28 assessment. I
48:37 | don't think you're going to see FY29.
48:39 | Their little matrix there showed like
48:42 | different years and different amounts.
48:43 | Is that because they would only borrow
48:45 | as they spend over five years
48:48 | and some of the items that they're
48:50 | doing. So when you borrow, you're only
48:51 | allowed to borrow for the what the state
48:53 | determines the life of that
48:55 | asset is.
48:56 | Asset is. So like buildings you can
48:58 | usually borrow for 20 years, but if
48:59 | you're doing, let's just say you're
49:01 | doing um
49:02 | phones, sidewalks,
49:03 | right? Those things probably only have
49:05 | an asset life of like five years. So you
49:07 | can only borrow for the life of what the
49:09 | asset is. So some of their borrowing, if
49:11 | you looked at that paperwork that was
49:13 | sent out, some of their borrowings,
49:16 | they're only obviously borrowing as they
49:17 | do. So they're borrowing probably pieces
49:19 | at a time, but then some of it also
49:21 | you're paying portions of it off in five
49:23 | years and then portions of it, I think,
49:24 | in 15.
49:25 | Okay. So it's different.
49:26 | It get kind of convoluted as you try to
49:28 | follow the
49:29 | and not all of them were were being done
49:31 | the same year. There were some that were
49:32 | being done
49:33 | right. I think it's a stagger 29 and 30.
49:36 | Yeah. So that's why you see some of
49:38 | sometimes um the cost spikes a little
49:41 | bit because they're probably adding on
49:42 | new debt
49:43 | and then some of it falls off as you go
49:45 | down because they're only borrowing for
49:46 | a couple years.
49:48 | And another thing that was a little
49:49 | confusing, you may want to explain how
49:52 | the majority vote goes per town. So the
49:55 | majority vote is the
49:57 | total amount of voters between both
50:00 | towns,
50:00 | right? to figure out. So if say 60% of
50:04 | Charlton vote v voters vote in fa v v v
50:06 | v v v v v v v v v v v v v v v v v v v v
50:06 | v v v v v v v v v v v v v v v v vote in
50:07 | favor of it um you know it depends on
50:09 | what what what the turnout is and you
50:12 | know only 30% of the Dudley voters do
50:14 | but it's a lower but it's a lower
50:16 | turnout and
50:18 | um you know essentially it ends up pass
50:20 | you know it ends up passing by the
50:22 | number of people that actually came out
50:24 | to vote between both towns. So one town
50:26 | could fail it but it could still pass
50:27 | overall. You're looking look at it as a
50:29 | it's a district vote. So a combination
50:31 | of the voters from Dudley and Charlton
50:33 | together as a district. Don't look at it
50:34 | as Dudley verse Charleton.
50:36 | They're looking at it as a total of
50:37 | voters coming out. So if 2,000 voters
50:40 | between the two towns come out and 60%
50:42 | of it passes, it doesn't matter if
50:44 | whether they were Charlton or Dudley
50:45 | voters. If it passes by 60% or 51%, it's
50:49 | assessed to both towns.
50:51 | Yeah. I mean, so even if every person in
50:52 | Dudley voted no and every person in
50:54 | Charlton voted yes and we had more
50:55 | people show up to the ballot, it's
50:57 | passing for both towns because it's a
50:59 | we were 5050 in Charleton and they were
51:01 | 75 against in Dudley, the whole thing
51:04 | fails.
51:05 | Exactly. 5050.
51:06 | If the numbers are there, right?
51:08 | But I'm That's the ratio.
51:09 | Yeah. So they look at it as it's it's a
51:11 | district vote. So it's a majority of
51:13 | both combined total voters.
51:16 | Yeah. that that I thought again was a
51:18 | little strange when I first heard it and
51:19 | I want to make sure everybody
51:20 | understood.
51:21 | And then also what's different is that
51:24 | because it's a district vote and it's
51:26 | their borrowing if it passes we have no
51:30 | choice to pay for this debt. So if it
51:32 | does pass whether we exclude it or not
51:35 | we are getting assessed the balance
51:37 | which is different from town borrowings
51:40 | because normally if we are going for a
51:42 | project and say we need an exclusion
51:44 | vote and the exclusion vote p fails but
51:46 | the town meeting authorization
51:49 | essentially passes we usually don't move
51:50 | forward with the project because we
51:52 | wouldn't be able to afford it or in this
51:53 | case if it passes at the district that
51:56 | if the district ballot vote passes yes
51:58 | and our debt exclusion ballot fails
52:02 | We would still have to pay for it.
52:04 | Correct. Because it's going to get
52:04 | assessed to us.
52:05 | We just have to amend our operating
52:07 | budget to account for it.
52:08 | Right.
52:08 | So at least see where the difference
52:10 | between capital and operating come in.
52:12 | Yeah. Very much.
52:13 | Yeah.
52:14 | So the school would assess us a portion
52:17 | of it would essentially come into their
52:18 | capital. So when the school gives us
52:20 | their assessment breakdown, it's
52:22 | operational capital and transportation.
52:24 | So this this borrowing would sit in that
52:27 | capital assessment from the school.
52:30 | Thank you.
52:30 | You're welcome.
52:31 | Okay. And if this does pass, they're
52:34 | going to start construction or they're
52:36 | going to start renovations.
52:38 | So, I think they would they would look
52:39 | to borrow sometime and it sounds like
52:41 | 2028 and then we probably wouldn't see
52:43 | the first payment. I think until 29.
52:45 | I was going to What was the timeline?
52:46 | I think so. I'd have to double check,
52:48 | but I'm pretty sure when I looked I
52:49 | don't think it would hit until 2029. So,
52:51 | you'd probably see it in your 29
52:53 | assessment. Yeah.
52:54 | Not your 28.
52:56 | Okay.
52:56 | Because usually the first year you
52:57 | borrow
52:59 | They're probably just going to we call
53:01 | it rolling a ban. So they're probably
53:02 | just going to borrow and they have to
53:03 | pay off interest. But if they borrow
53:05 | after July 1st, the first payment won't
53:07 | be due until the following July 1. So it
53:09 | would hit your FY29 budget.
53:11 | Do we have any capital projects coming
53:13 | off?
53:14 | No.
53:15 | From our perspective,
53:17 | no.
53:17 | Uh we put it in
53:19 | I couldn't remember.
53:20 | There's not.
53:21 | Hold on.
53:22 | Not until
53:24 | the next one. Yep. 2031, which is a fire
53:26 | engine replacement, but they're in
53:28 | generally a fiveyear cycle with their
53:30 | replacement. So, you hit where we pay
53:33 | off one, the next one.
53:34 | We're gonna buy another one, right? And
53:36 | it's going to be You want to talk about
53:37 | rising cost? You ought to see how fire
53:39 | trucks go, right, Brian? What's the cost
53:41 | of a fire truck today?
53:44 | 3 million for a ladder, 1.5 for an
53:46 | engine.
53:47 | Yeah,
53:47 | imagine that.
53:48 | They're not cheap and they take like
53:50 | three years to like build basically to
53:52 | get here
53:52 | if you can find them,
53:53 | right? So, a question I've always
53:56 | wondered and I think we should address
53:57 | it at the town meeting just because I
53:59 | know it's on a lot of people's minds and
54:00 | no one wants to ask it because I never
54:02 | have either. What is if if everything
54:04 | gets approved, let's say everything goes
54:06 | to floor and everybody is ra for all the
54:08 | last things. What is the most someone's
54:11 | taxes percentage wise could go up per
54:14 | year? Is there a cap on it? Because I
54:16 | know on like a prop two and a half, it
54:18 | can only go up two and a half%.
54:19 | But it's as a total of a town. So like
54:22 | your taxes could go up four and a half
54:24 | percent, but let's say Hanks only went
54:26 | up like one and a half percent.
54:28 | How? Because it's an average of the
54:30 | whole town.
54:31 | So think of think of it as a as a pie,
54:33 | right?
54:33 | Realistically, so that pie can only grow
54:36 | two and a half% per per year, right? But
54:39 | the assessed value of every little slice
54:41 | of that pie can shift, right? So res a
54:44 | residential property let's just like
54:47 | residential if it's growing at a much
54:49 | higher
54:50 | rate than say industrial
54:52 | then those then essentially that tax
54:56 | bill for a residential may grow at a
54:58 | much substant much more substantial rate
55:00 | because it's based off of that tax rate
55:03 | um is you know whatever the tax rate
55:05 | that's determined is
55:07 | um if you take your assessed value
55:12 | um divide it by a thousand and then
55:14 | times the tax rate is what your tax bill
55:16 | is,
55:17 | right?
55:17 | So, you know, depending on what the
55:19 | global value is and how your total value
55:22 | of your house compares to that global
55:24 | value of the town is kind of how that
55:28 | budget how that budget is broken out,
55:30 | right?
55:31 | So, I under I I understand that
55:34 | different houses assess it different
55:37 | amounts,
55:37 | right? Extremely well, actually. Um and
55:40 | I understand that Hank's house is worth
55:42 | a million and my house is worth 50,000,
55:44 | Hank's tax bill is going to go up
55:45 | exponentially more than mine at the same
55:47 | percentage. But how are the percentages
55:49 | different? Because I understand that if
55:51 | we we increase it by 3%. Obviously
55:53 | Hank's p tax bill is going to go up way
55:55 | up and mine is going to go up a lot for
55:57 | me, but only three 3% 3%. It's just 3%
56:00 | of different numbers.
56:01 | How are the percentages different?
56:03 | That's what I don't understand. So what
56:04 | we what we do when we kind of get to
56:07 | this phase of the year is that we have
56:09 | generally high confidence as to what the
56:11 | new new growth and the assessed values
56:14 | are going to be for all the prop for all
56:16 | the properties.
56:17 | So we're able to determine generally
56:20 | what the average single family tax bill
56:23 | is. So any any of the 100 class
56:27 | properties and what's what's the lowest
56:29 | highest you know median uh average. And
56:32 | so as we plug in our our you know our
56:35 | budgetary numbers,
56:37 | we kind of try to stick we we our target
56:40 | goal is about three and a half% about
56:43 | $180
56:45 | on the average single family tax bill
56:47 | that we're that is kind of like our
56:49 | target goal. And if all these if
56:51 | everything passes, we're going to be
56:52 | we're going to be there. It doesn't mean
56:54 | that anybody's individual ones may vary,
56:57 | right? um especially if you if you did
56:59 | an addition to your house or some or
57:00 | sure something like that. It might it's
57:02 | it might change it uh differently, but
57:04 | that's kind of the our target as we're
57:06 | doing this.
57:07 | Now, we h do have substantial excess
57:09 | money capacity right now. So, we could
57:12 | tax we could go and amend the budget
57:16 | substantially higher than what it is
57:19 | without a debt ex without a debt
57:21 | exclusion vote. I think right now that
57:23 | number is 2 millionish.
57:26 | I have it.
57:26 | It's approximately $2 million right now
57:29 | that we've left on the table that we
57:30 | have the authority to tax without an
57:32 | override.
57:34 | And if we did that, then that tax bill
57:37 | could go up to, you know, it could be I
57:41 | don't know if we even ran that number.
57:43 | I don't think we did. No, but
57:44 | but I we could essentially just by
57:46 | amending the budget tap into that number
57:48 | without going for a debt exclusion vote,
57:50 | but your taxes would go up obviously
57:52 | substantially. Well, and I think that's
57:54 | something that has needs to be addressed
57:58 | because the biggest fear out there is if
58:00 | things pass because right now, as Jamie
58:02 | mentioned, there's big things going on
58:03 | at the school. There's big things going
58:04 | on at the senior center. There's lots of
58:06 | big things and it's a very people are
58:08 | it's really tight out there right now.
58:09 | People are watching pennies. Um people
58:11 | need to know what the max is because
58:13 | they're going to there's a lot of fear
58:15 | out there that they're just not going to
58:17 | be able to afford to keep stay in their
58:18 | homes, right? Um, and I think that if we
58:20 | could appease some of that and let them
58:22 | know that sure, and I mean they know
58:25 | what their assessed values are, but the
58:26 | max it can go is say three and a half
58:28 | percent. That at least will give someone
58:29 | a number in their head as opposed to
58:31 | thinking that their tax bill will go
58:32 | from and I'm making up numbers now, but
58:35 | from $300 a quarter to $1,200 a quarter.
58:37 | So essentially we always so like before
58:39 | we even came before we once we got free
58:42 | cash certified Andrew myself and the
58:44 | assessor sat down because she kind of
58:45 | had an idea what new growth was at this
58:47 | point and we plugged all the numbers
58:48 | into their tax rate formula and kind of
58:51 | played around with okay well what if we
58:52 | did this what if we did that um and then
58:55 | when we plugged in obviously this is
58:58 | high level when we plugged in some
58:59 | numbers and did the math we want to stay
59:02 | like interested right around the $180
59:04 | mark which is like a three three and a
59:05 | half% increase to and That's what we've
59:07 | been growing every year. So, obviously,
59:09 | if you if you look at whatever our um
59:13 | median home value is right now, it's
59:15 | like right 5.45.
59:17 | Yeah. So, if you look at that number and
59:19 | you know what your home value is, if
59:20 | it's more than that, obviously your
59:21 | taxes are going to go up a little bit
59:22 | more. If your number is under that,
59:23 | obviously you're going to go down a
59:25 | little bit more. So, if you go by that,
59:27 | we always try to stick right at that 3%
59:29 | and we try not to go higher than that.
59:30 | Right.
59:31 | Okay. Obviously, if we did go higher
59:32 | than that, then
59:33 | really, if you if you look at a lot of
59:34 | other towns and especially the ones that
59:36 | are right right on the ed that every
59:38 | year they budget to the max,
59:40 | right?
59:41 | Go back two years uh you know, two or
59:43 | three years ago when that housing market
59:45 | was really going when $200,000 valued
59:48 | homes were going up to $400,000.
59:51 | Every other communities, their average
59:54 | single or their tax bills were going up
59:56 | exponentially, right? because it was
59:58 | growing so much more than than the
59:59 | industrial rate and they were being
60:01 | slammed with that portion of of the pie.
60:04 | But because we were able to get
60:06 | additional uh the new growth through
60:08 | Amazon and other factors, we've been
60:11 | able to use that factor to maintain a
60:13 | stable increase compared to the towns
60:16 | and really what um when we go out to
60:18 | bond they also look at what you've been
60:20 | doing. So that also plays into a factor
60:21 | of our borrowing rate too because it's
60:23 | looks at your financial stability.
60:25 | Nice. So that's why we look at it so
60:28 | closely too because we're really trying
60:29 | to get to that tripaa.
60:32 | We can.
60:32 | Thank you.
60:34 | So that's the election coming up on the
60:36 | 29th. What else we got about the
60:38 | schools?
60:38 | So we met with them today. Um it was a
60:42 | um in how it say invest pre evaluation
60:46 | of
60:47 | better
60:49 | whether or not to accept heritage school
60:51 | into the MSBA program. And you know,
60:54 | obviously we we kind of dipped our toes
60:57 | into it with Shepherd Hill a couple
60:59 | years ago and didn't move forward,
61:00 | [clears throat] but we're really kind of
61:02 | leading up to that same point. So, um,
61:06 | what we kind of gathered out of that is
61:08 | on December 9th, the MSBA will decide
61:11 | whether or not to invite, uh, a heritage
61:14 | school into the program. So the first
61:16 | phase in that and the school needs to
61:19 | decide what grades it wants to consider
61:21 | as part of it. Whether or not it's just
61:23 | this just the grades that are inherited
61:25 | school right now or if they want to
61:26 | expand it to other you know to to other
61:31 | potentially consolidate other schools
61:34 | into a into a larger program. But they
61:36 | have to make that they have to make that
61:37 | decision I think before the end of
61:40 | before yeah before October
61:42 | second. So, um, if they're invited into
61:46 | the program, they have 270 days to
61:50 | establish a building committee and to
61:52 | appropriate funds for a feasibility
61:55 | study. And so, the feasibility study, as
61:59 | you remember from the Shepherd Hill
62:01 | project, is probably around a million
62:02 | dollars. You know, they're going to have
62:04 | they're gonna have to kind of figure out
62:06 | what's the right number, but it was, you
62:08 | know, the
62:09 | I think two million was like the cap.
62:11 | They were like $750,000 to 2 million. So
62:15 | realistically, they were saying the $2
62:16 | million number that's a that's a Voke
62:18 | school that needs to be built and they
62:20 | want to consider multiple lots. That's a
62:23 | $2 million assessment,
62:24 | right?
62:25 | You're probably closer this probably
62:27 | closer to the million dollars. Just
62:29 | we're going to use that as our as our
62:31 | benchmark for right now. So
62:34 | we would essentially either be looking
62:37 | and I don't know if I I kind of have to
62:38 | like build back from the timeline. So
62:40 | she basically said what they do is so
62:42 | December I think 9th they make their
62:44 | award. So, we will find out for sure
62:46 | December 9th or somewhere around there.
62:48 | The school will find out if we are
62:51 | accepted into this MSBA program and
62:52 | they're going to move forward and then
62:54 | they say they work with the school
62:55 | committee and or the school district and
62:57 | then they're also going to work with the
62:59 | town because um what's different about
63:00 | this project that was not done with
63:03 | Shephard Hill because Shepard Hills is a
63:04 | shared school is that this MSBA will be
63:08 | 100% on Charlton. And what we didn't
63:10 | know is this all is so this is going to
63:12 | be like it's our project because it's
63:13 | our school even though it's a district
63:16 | school. It's in Charleston. So it's 100%
63:18 | off. So it's our ballot vote only for
63:20 | Charlton members and it's our town
63:22 | meeting vote. So and you wouldn't have a
63:24 | town meeting vote for um the district
63:28 | because the district borrows. So this
63:29 | will be our borrowing. We are going to
63:30 | 100% own it. So, what they say is
63:32 | they're going to work with the district
63:33 | and the town to figure out what works
63:35 | best with our town meeting dates for the
63:38 | 270 days because that's all they give
63:40 | you. So, what they'll do is they might
63:42 | give you your she called it something
63:44 | different than an award date, but I'll
63:45 | use they'll even invitation date.
63:48 | Yes, that's the word she used. So, even
63:50 | though they award us on the 9th, they
63:52 | could give us an invitation date of like
63:53 | say February 15th or something. And then
63:55 | we would have 270 days from that day to
63:58 | do the building committee to come up
64:00 | with the feasibility study money and um
64:04 | there's a few other things but those are
64:05 | those are the biggest hurdles was to get
64:07 | to really that that financial commitment
64:09 | and then once that once they do all that
64:11 | then you would have to go for they you
64:13 | would have a dollar amount and know what
64:15 | they're doing and then that's when we
64:16 | would have to go for the debt exclusion
64:18 | and then the approved project at town
64:20 | meeting. So that's obviously would be
64:22 | years down the road, but if it if this
64:25 | all does happen this year, it's closer
64:27 | down the road than I think what we
64:30 | originally thought. Obviously, if we
64:31 | don't get the award in December, then
64:33 | they have to go and re-enter the program
64:34 | again.
64:36 | So between the capital coming this month
64:39 | and then that potentially being on the
64:41 | in the back coming up, you're going to
64:43 | have two big school projects coming up.
64:45 | And obviously this redoing a school is
64:47 | going to be a lot more than $6 million.
64:50 | So you're going to have that coming.
64:51 | They're talking about remodeling or
64:53 | well it's either remodeling they have to
64:55 | that's all feasibility studies. The
64:57 | first part is to identify what grades
64:59 | you want to consider. And it doesn't
65:01 | mean that you have to include all of
65:03 | them at the end of the day
65:04 | but you know you can't you can't widen
65:07 | the scope after you've already been
65:09 | right approved into the program. So they
65:12 | may say, you know, preK through 8, but
65:15 | you know, realistically
65:17 | there's probably not really an appetite
65:19 | to fund a project so massive that we're
65:21 | closing two schools to build, you know,
65:25 | eliminating three schools to build one.
65:26 | So they may look at preK through
65:30 | four
65:30 | or something. Yeah,
65:32 | that's all up to the school committee. I
65:33 | think that they probably would work with
65:35 | the town because it's going to have to
65:36 | be an appetite obviously the town too,
65:38 | but they have to make that decision
65:39 | before October 2nd to be able to get
65:41 | into the program essentially to go
65:44 | further. So like this I guess tour kind
65:47 | of thing that we had today um was I
65:50 | think I like the second step of this pro
65:52 | process and then if they get awarded it
65:54 | in December then that would be like the
65:56 | next step to go for the feasibility
65:58 | and then if they don't then they kind of
65:59 | go back to this whole tour
66:02 | step again they'd have to reapply. If
66:03 | they get the invite in December.
66:05 | Yeah.
66:06 | Say, "Okay, we're going to give you a
66:07 | January 15th." That's your invite date,
66:09 | right?
66:10 | How soon after that do we have to come
66:12 | up with?
66:13 | You have 270 days.
66:15 | Oh, for the plan. No, but to finance it.
66:17 | 270 days.
66:19 | Finance the feasibility. The feasibility
66:20 | study.
66:21 | Yeah. Then it's then it gets to the next
66:22 | phase. We even talk about phase two,
66:24 | right?
66:24 | So,
66:25 | okay. Okay. Yeah.
66:26 | So you you have just just have to fund
66:28 | the feasibility study for now and come
66:29 | up with the
66:29 | building. 270 days was the time you did
66:32 | the feasibility study.
66:34 | No.
66:34 | I got you.
66:35 | So they give you 270 days to secure
66:37 | funding for the feasibility study. Get a
66:39 | building committee together and I think
66:40 | and start the process of the feasibility
66:43 | study.
66:43 | Okay.
66:44 | I don't think it needs I didn't think it
66:45 | needed to be completed in the 270 days.
66:48 | They just give you the first few hurdles
66:49 | you got to jump through and then they'll
66:50 | give you the rest if you can get that
66:51 | done.
66:52 | Right. They kind of they kind of know
66:54 | where projects either thrive or die,
66:56 | right?
66:56 | Yeah.
66:59 | All right. And at some point, I'll just
67:02 | throw this out. We're going to need new
67:04 | high school.
67:05 | That's coming.
67:06 | Yeah. So, they did say that
67:09 | I I'm assuming the temp. So because we
67:12 | passed the feasibility study for Shepard
67:14 | Hill, when they went back to go look
67:16 | based on their the architect study that
67:19 | they had done of all the schools and
67:21 | Heritage being a high priority, I think
67:23 | they kind of pushed that forward more
67:26 | knowing that we were supporting Shepherd
67:29 | Hill. So maybe we would support
67:30 | Heritage. I'm assuming that played a
67:31 | factor into their decision. So because
67:33 | that was asked why they didn't go for
67:35 | Shepherd Hill again. So, I'm assuming
67:37 | that would be coming at some point,
67:40 | but
67:41 | and that's a big nut.
67:42 | Yeah,
67:43 | it's going to be a very big nut.
67:46 | Any other question? Uh Jamie, Brian,
67:49 | Christian, any questions on this school
67:52 | subject?
67:54 | Nothing from me.
67:57 | Nothing from me.
68:00 | No, I don't have any questions either.
68:01 | Good. All right.
68:03 | Then let's All right. So item six, the
68:05 | discussion of the feasibil the senior
68:07 | center. We've kind of done that. You've
68:10 | got a new request here for two more
68:12 | people.
68:13 | Yep. So um if you and this isn't in
68:17 | front of um those online, but I had So
68:21 | back in January when we were going
68:23 | through budget rounds, the fire chief
68:25 | had asked for his four bodies plus a
68:27 | fire inspector.
68:29 | We funded his four bodies, but we didn't
68:30 | fund his fire inspector. So, he did come
68:33 | back and ask for his the fire inspector
68:35 | position again. And then I also had a
68:38 | request from police um just looking at
68:41 | their um structure down there with the
68:45 | potential of um they have some things
68:48 | that they want would like to accomplish
68:50 | and then maybe with people retiring and
68:52 | what whatnot. Um they're just kind of
68:54 | looking at the future of the department.
68:57 | They were looking at adding another
68:58 | police lieutenant. So have you'd have
69:00 | the chief deputy and then you'd have two
69:02 | lieutenants. Um
69:04 | and they're just looking at obviously I
69:07 | don't want to put words but they're
69:08 | looking at doing that. So I had the
69:09 | request for those two bodies. Um
69:12 | when we
69:13 | they want that voted on and
69:15 | they would they wanted us
69:17 | they asked us to consider.
69:18 | Yes. So, um, when we were looking at
69:22 | once we got, um, free cash certified and
69:24 | we are pretty close with new growth, we
69:26 | plugged obviously all the numbers in and
69:28 | we played around with if we were to, um,
69:30 | amend the budget and add money in to
69:33 | support these positions. Um,
69:37 | we're just raising the tax bill higher
69:39 | than I think what we wanted to because
69:41 | we don't really have as much new growth,
69:43 | I think, as we thought we were going to.
69:45 | I I don't know if it's I don't think
69:47 | it's really that we thought we going to
69:48 | because as you remember when we we
69:50 | budget around we used $250,000 as our as
69:53 | our estimate for what our new growth was
69:56 | going to be next year knowing that was a
69:57 | very conservative number right
69:59 | but as you remember when I talked to
70:01 | this board I said to maintain our
70:03 | current level of operations based off
70:05 | our current staffing we realistically
70:07 | had to hit a million dollars in new
70:09 | growth year-over-year
70:11 | is kind of where we had to get that's
70:13 | kind of like had to be the new the new
70:15 | normal
70:15 | without saying that right because every
70:17 | body that you add is a long-term
70:19 | commitment that you have to build for
70:20 | future years in multiple operate
70:23 | operational areas of the budget.
70:26 | We hit our benchmark.
70:29 | We're pretty much on our benchmark as to
70:31 | what we need to maintain our current
70:33 | level of operations as we look at this
70:35 | year. But we're not blowing it out of
70:36 | the water. And I just don't think that
70:41 | bringing now midyear adjustments is a
70:44 | very good way it a very advisable
70:48 | approach and I think that if we take
70:50 | these under advisement and ensure that
70:53 | in the next few months as we develop our
70:55 | FY28 budget and we can get some revised
70:57 | projections that we can take these under
71:00 | further further further advisement
71:02 | consideration. I just think right now
71:05 | just coming right off the tail of
71:06 | looking at to all right where are we
71:09 | currently and where are we going
71:11 | let's put a pause on new any new hires
71:13 | right
71:15 | I concur with that me
71:18 | yeah no problem
71:19 | and I think no matter which way you look
71:21 | at it whether they
71:22 | whether they could do it within their
71:24 | budget now you still obviously have the
71:27 | long-term cost but you're still no
71:28 | matter what we're still adding benefit
71:31 | costs so like even if they can fund it
71:33 | even within their budget. Like even if
71:34 | they came to me and said I can fund it
71:36 | within my budget, I still have to fund
71:37 | for the benefit cost. So it's not just
71:40 | insurance, but it's Medicare and then
71:42 | retirement and all that. So I still have
71:43 | to take that into consideration. So even
71:45 | my assumption would be if they say they
71:47 | can do it within their budget, they're
71:48 | talking about every cost associated,
71:50 | right? Yeah. And they don't budget for
71:52 | all the rest of the stuff, right? And
71:54 | the thing is too, you know, as we're
71:55 | talking about the schools, you know,
71:57 | let's just say this um loan
71:59 | authorization passes in the end of
72:02 | September, but we can't get a debt
72:04 | exclusion pass. Well, now we have to
72:06 | factor in
72:07 | operational
72:07 | those that that amount into the
72:09 | operational budget.
72:10 | And also remember that for
72:14 | every time, well, let's just say if we
72:15 | had a million dollars in new growth, the
72:17 | school is 50% of our budget. the school
72:19 | is going to take half of maybe not
72:21 | exactly half of that, but your we're
72:24 | growing at a faster pace than what
72:25 | Dudley is. So, our um
72:28 | the minimum net school spend amount is
72:30 | going to shift more and more towards us
72:32 | because we're growing a lot faster than
72:33 | they are. So, that shift we have to take
72:35 | that into consideration too.
72:38 | And we had quite a few pretty high years
72:41 | with Amazon and that hasn't caught up to
72:43 | us yet because it's always I feel like
72:45 | the school formula is always like two or
72:47 | three years behind. three years.
72:48 | So we have to account for that too is
72:50 | that that's going to start catching up
72:52 | to us now. So I think the shift is
72:53 | really going to start shifting.
72:55 | Okay. So we're going to take under
72:57 | adisement for the future of
72:59 | Yeah. I told
73:00 | Yeah. I will tell both of them if you
73:02 | guys agree that they it's not a no. It's
73:05 | a no for right now, but come back to me
73:07 | in three four months when you're coming
73:08 | for budget.
73:09 | Jamie, Brian, Christian, you agree with
73:11 | that? You take that under adisement?
73:15 | I agree with that. But I would also like
73:16 | to say personally I think that they'd
73:19 | have to make a really strong case that
73:21 | this is necessary
73:23 | versus the other expenses that we have
73:26 | in front of us
73:27 | right
73:28 | in the in the future when we talk about
73:30 | right that's why I figured it'd be
73:31 | better to look at it during budget cycle
73:32 | than it is to look at it now because as
73:34 | in the budget cycle then we're looking
73:36 | at everything as a whole rather than
73:38 | just right now
73:41 | because we could probably afford it
73:42 | right now but
73:44 | I would like to look at it years. I want
73:46 | to look at it for long term.
73:47 | Right. Exactly. Exactly.
73:49 | And speaking of budget cycles and the
73:52 | rest of it, right? So, just to go over
73:54 | our schedule for upcoming. So, we've got
73:58 | uh we're meeting next week, next
73:59 | Tuesday. It's right with the uh board of
74:02 | selectmen and we'll go through the
74:04 | Yes.
74:05 | And we'll we'll do the support or
74:07 | or deny the October town meeting the
74:11 | 19th. And then we've got uh two more
74:15 | regular meetings before we start the
74:17 | budgets.
74:18 | Correct.
74:18 | Right. In January,
74:20 | one thing I did want to mention when
74:21 | when you're setting up Ashley, you do a
74:24 | great job of setting up the schedules.
74:25 | Yeah.
74:26 | Start the first one at 6:45, not 6:30.
74:31 | Give us that first 15 minutes of the
74:33 | meeting. Okay.
74:33 | Okay. To get ourselves
74:35 | Okay.
74:35 | organized. That's that's the only caveat
74:37 | I would I would throw to that one.
74:39 | And then it's we've got down at some
74:42 | point in February. Yeah. Meeting with
74:43 | the school department because they're
74:44 | going to have proposed the next budget.
74:46 | Okay.
74:48 | That's all I have.
74:49 | You still want to just do your three
74:50 | meetings, your January, February, March
74:52 | for the budget hearings. Okay.
74:55 | Yep. Anybody got anything else they want
74:57 | to bring up tonight before I ask for a
75:01 | motion to adjurnn?
75:05 | All silent over there. Okay. Anything
75:07 | over here? We good? I'll I'll entertain
75:09 | a motion to adjurnn.
75:11 | I have a motion. I have a second.
75:13 | Any discussion? All those in favor say
75:15 | yes.
75:16 | Yes.
75:17 | Yes.
75:18 | Jamie.
75:19 | Yes.
75:20 | Brian, yes. It's unanimous. Thank you
75:22 | all very much. Good night.
75:25 | Good night.